inclusion to tip resources Lyricists and collabs

sidshovel

Lyricists: if your lucky to get two or more offers from forum musicians to collaborate (collab) on a song you have written, it is simple courtesy to go with the first offer. This is well understood between the muso's and no offence will be taken or given.

RainyDayMan

Sid, I'll hold five on this for the moment, cause I'm not really sure where it goes yet!

But I would add that once you have agreed to collab with someone (not just received an offer) you have actually entered into a legal contract with them. Not only is there an ethical consideration, but also a legal one at that point. In order to do anything with the song, permission of all rights holders is required. So you can't legally just choose to drop writer1 in favor of writer2 without their consent. Though like most contractual matters these things only really surface once there is money on the table. But it's interesting to note that by default (meaning no other specific agreement is in place) all songwriters hold equal rights to the composition as a whole - both lyrics and music. So when you and I collab, by default you own half the rights to the music, and I own half the rights to the lyric. You can of course make other agreements if everyone agrees to, but most people wouldn't even consider contractual terms until they have something sizzling hot and the prospect of making money seems likely, at which point the default agreement is usually already in place, and if your co-writers don't want to change it...

sidshovel

Well, I never knew that! Just goes to show you this resource tips is really an eye opener, suggest you copy this response at some point to the resources, I'm sure there are a lot of people out there as ignorant as me on the subject. Wouldn't expect any issues on the forum arising out of collabs, but if Ed Sheeran turns up on my doorstep, I've got you to thank for cutting a good deal.

Love this forum!

Sid

RainyDayMan

I probably should clarify that the musical composition rights I was talking about are separate to the rights for a recording. For example, with ABBA, Bjorn and Benny wrote all the songs - they own the rights to the compositions (music+lyric) but the whole band recorded the songs and share the rights to those recordings - and maybe the producer and any session musicians involved as well (though session musos often contribute on a 'work for hire' basis, and get paid upfront in lieu of ongoing royalties). And when someone else wants to record a cover of an ABBA song, they need permission plus pay a license to Bjorn & Benny, but they then own the rights to their own recording.

sidshovel

Thank you, the whole thread is very enlightening. Puts the phrase "show business" into a proper perspective.

Question, Do session musicians and recording studios waive upfront charges if they opt to get a cut of royalties?

Thanks for giving your time to educate as well as manage.

Sid

RainyDayMan

I don't know what 'standard' practice looks like in the industry Sid.

I think for you and I, a studio or a session musician is going to want to be paid 100% upfront, as taking royalties is much riskier for them.

Beyond that I suppose that any combination of upfront fees and royalties is possible, subject to negotiation.

sidshovel

That makes sense, thanks so much for the insight.

Sid