Ai Issues
In case you are thinking of subscribing to Suno Ai.
Over the last week and to date the app is behaving extremely eratically. The faults are too numerous to mention but accept it is making the app almost impractical to use. My strong advice to any considering purchasing a subscription would be to hold fire until/if the problems are solved. If anything changes I'll update immediately.
Sid
P.S. If anyone has further info please post here.
Comments
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Thanks for the update Sid! I haven't been on there recently. Didn't know it had degraded so much.
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All the hallmarks of a sprint to an IPO
Sid
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Forgetting any reservations I may have about AI generated music, I would be very hesitant to spend any money for these services at the moment. The quality of service is obviously one factor which you've pointed out here, but I'd also want to know exactly where I stood with copyright. Once I've generated a piece of music using AI, does that song actually become entirely mine? I haven't looked into the terms and conditions of any of these services as I have no intention of going down this route, but it's something that would need to be crystal clear before I spent any money.
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Hi Chris, from my reading of their blurb, assuming your lyrics, the free mode, they own the music and vocals, you retain copyright of your own lyrics. If you buy a subscription, you get extra credits plus own the copyright on everything in perpetuity. They also include a caveat stating the copyright law in relation to Ai is in a nascent stage and advise consulting a lawyer should you be concerned. The acid test will come when a real artist claims copyright infringement by an Ai in a court of law, then the sparks will fly!
Sid
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Interesting Sid. As you suggest, there's the potential for some serious legal shenanigans as things develop.
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'They also include a caveat stating the copyright law in relation to Ai is in a nascent stage and advise consulting a lawyer should you be concerned.'
That's exactly what would concern me if I was considering using AI to generate music. I have a feeling that the rules could change as AI providers look to expand and, dare I say, get rich quick! I'd be very hesitant to pay for any subscription until some of this stuff has been properly tested legally.
On the plus side you might want to check out Udio (if you haven't already): https://www.udio.com/
I had a quick look at their terms and conditions which look to be fair. I'd still tread carefully though. I haven't tried their services but some of the material on the site sounds pretty good.
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I did check out Udio and 2-3 other lesser known ones.
Looking and comparing their FAQ's in relation to copyright, they all operated their copyright ownership in very similar ways. Almost an industry standard, collusion or copying? This a wild west gold rush to the promised IPO, Suno's dash to introduce new features is affecting the stability of the basic code the app is built on. I've written to Suno asking for an explanation but haven't heard back yet. Owen passed on a likely late bloomer in this Ai race, it looks highly promising indeed. I would totally agree to wait before paying a subscription, there's still far too much dust in the air.
Sid
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Damn "Glass Heart " sounds real to me on there , Who knows on copyrights on all that . I doubt kids on here have lawyers , Unless they're in the big show going against majors . Hard to say. Who knows with the industry on all this Robot music, Billion pros talking about it . they'll probably have a robot when it feels a bite it will hook the fish and reel it in , While we all get Walmart fat
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'While we all get Walmart fat'
Great song title Elvis!!😁
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Are we talking Jim Gaffigan fat or Walmart fat ? , ole Jims funny
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Well I guess about everything is AI now , Why were Walmart fat or getting their and lazy . I guess unless you own a Shelby Mustang your not going to hand wash it . I wasted 15 bucks going thru a carwash , robots , complete waste of time . move forword ,back up , bs I'm outta here . Sitting on a couch waiting for doordash , how lazy can we get , whats next the driver feeds us ?
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Latest update,
Received a reply from Suno re complaint of quality dropoff. As expected, corporate waffle, pat yourself on the back and don't say anything relevant. Hello!. people don't accept that anymore, move or move over.
Link to Reddit thread showing how widespread the problem is: https://www.reddit.com/r/SunoAI/comments/1c1bag6/suno_performance_these_last_few_days/, it's a month old but nothings changed.
Summary. Poor performance and quality issues still persist. Do not subscribe, use free version. Try Udio, has overtaken Suno, may be better long term prospect. There are some potential new starts in the pipeline, so maybe hangfire for a while till the hype dust settles.
Practical Tip: Avoid entering long lines of verse in the lyric box. Whilst Suno breaks them to fit, many times, it does so in the wrong places and it sounds terrible. Break them yourself at the natural places and enter them that way into the box. The vocals will flow a lot smoother.
Sid
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Suno's current score on Trust Pilot is 2.9, worth reading if your thinking of subscribing!
Current status update: Imploding rapidly
Sid
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Can anyone comment on how many credits, (on average) it takes to process a std VVCVCBC song using UDIO please?
Thank you Sid
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Suno just brought out an initial 4 minute first clip. This will cover the needs of 90% of songs but for many it will have a minute plus outro, which is a problem since Suno tends to fill space with gibberish, If you have a song like this, cut the end off with this simple web cutter, Online MP3 Cutter - Cut Songs, Make Ringtones. Don't load their app add-on onto your browser, they make dozens of apps and they keep pushing them. Just use their web page when you need to and close it when your finished. Really simple to use, Slide the righthand slider to the time you want the song to finish, press play to check it's good, and save to download it.
Sid
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Suno seem to have resolved their initial problems, thousands of refunds tend to focus the mind a tad!
My current assessment is that Suno is pulling ahead of Udio in terms of quality and features.
Udio appears to have fallen into "me too" mode chasing Suno innovations and novelty features.
On both sides, they appear to be ignoring fundamental "must haves" in favour of "it looks and sounds good but is essentially useless".
The first person any IT company should employ is a non-geek, he'll be the one with his hair combed!
Sid
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BREAKING NEWS
Leading record labels have just announced they intend to sue Suno and Udio for copyright infringement.
Dam, is that a crack?
Hold off on any intended subscrption purchase until dust clears,
Udio already states no refunds under any circimstances,
Be warned!!!!!
Sid
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Not really a surprise , Do you really think major labels are going sit on their laurels having AI threaten their revenue base ? Like a murder trial , its not who's wrong or right , Its who's got the best lawyers ? Any wagers ? it comes down on what side of the fence your on.. O.J AI. or Sony. Streaming services and AI are Ted Bunday and we feed and clothe him. But like the cartels and governments, its kinda hard to tell who's the bigger crook. Last time I looked money has never had any empathy. Intelligence is a bit scary sometimes, we don't wanna end up like Virginia Woolf. God and I have a lot in common , with both can't balance a check book and hate cities .
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I'm only surprised that it hasn't happened sooner.
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I think the global media companies know, one false move and they will hang themselves on their own petard.
Currently, as evidenced by lawsuits in cases such as George Harrison and Ed Sheeran, evidence is presented in a subjective form, i.e. sounds like. In a digital age, music is best defined in its mathematical form, oranges v oranges. If that is the case then the canned worms will have a field day. why is a copy not a clone? The current (and past) definitions of copyright infringement may no longer apply. The implications are global and way beyond the scope of music in its application.
Sid
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Gathering ammunition to destroy them . M-60 tanks and such like Nabster. bombs away
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We all act like we have record deals , why would I give a damn about major labels and robots lol
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It's going to be very interesting to see where all this goes Sid. As a musician I know what I think, but what I think has nothing to do with it. I'm beginning to understand now why some people have been warning about the dangers of Ai. To be honest, I never gave it much thought until recently.
As a hobbyist musician/songwriter, I think the trick is to use as much or as little of it as feels right. If we don't like it we can always keep it at arms length. But for those at the sharp end who're trying to earn a living/build a career in music, there's an awful lot at stake here.
And that's before we even start to get into the wider implications of Ai.
Just my opinion of course.
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Your absolutely right Chris. From day one of discussions of Ai on this forum, I have taken the position of use it but strictly control it. My biggest concern is who defines the controls, Global Media do not have a good record when it comes to the welfare of the artists, per se. They would just as readily negotiate a settlement based on a cut of the deal for themselves rather than ensuring the wellbeing of artists and musicians. I expect the E.U. to define the role of Ai within it's borders and establish the standard that others will be dragged kicking and screaming into, vis-a-vis Data Protection.
Microsoft and the Hedge Funds will not roll-over easily, this is not a fight for altruism, it is one of sharing the spoils.
Sid
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The music industry is still haunted by the specter of Napster, and the rise of AI-generated music introduces several possible competitive threats to their business models; right now, for example, nobody at a label sees royalties for an AI-generated song from Sudo or Udio, even if it resembles their work. “Synthetic musical outputs could saturate the market with machine-generated content that will directly compete with, cheapen, and ultimately drown out the genuine sound recordings on which the service is built,” the labels allege in their complaint.
The complaints underline a growing consensus in the music industry that licensing is the only proper way forward. “There is room for AI and human creators to forge a sustainable, complementary relationship,” the Suno complaint says. “This can and should be achieved through the well-established mechanism of free-market licensing that ensures proper respect for copyright owners.”
That will saturate the market and drown out real players for nothing , i can see their point . You put in lyrics and steal the music , basically , If you pay a % to use the robots that seems fair , But still floods the market with robots and drowns out real artists .
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Hi everyone,
Thank you to the huge number of viewers of this thread, we appreciate your visit and encourage you to check out the other interesting threads and resources available at TSF.
As a way of showing my own personal gratitude, heres some tips for those still struggling with Ai generated songs.
The biggest problem most people report is getting a decent song generated using text prompts. It can be very hit and miss and waste all your credits to no avail. Well never say Sid left you hangin'!
Here's a simple solution I use every day and it works 90% of the time.
For arguments sake, say you've written some great lyrics and you think they would sound great if Juice Springs Teen recorded them, well try this:
Go into the Discover in Udio, that's where people publish their generations under different genres, there is the equivalent in Suno. Find the genre(s) of your choice, check out ones with potential to sound like what your after. Open the song and you'll see the prompt and tabs used to generate that song, Copy the text for prompt and tabs. paste it somewhere handy.
Now go to create song in Udio/Suno, put your own lyrics in, paste your copied prompt into prompt box, in Suno there is a limit of 120 characters so be selective from the copied prompt, leave enough characters for this: include at the end of the prompt these words "in the style of xxxxxxxxxxxx" x in this case being Juice Springs Teen or whichever artist you choose, e.g. Saylor Twift. Ai may not accept artist names but will insert equivalent terms into the prompt. Suno may flatly refuse to process the request, in which case play around with the "in the style of part", e.g. try, like, same as, similar, etc, be creative till it accepts it.
This strategy will put you in the ballpark, not necessarily on the dime, but you'll save a lot of credits.
Let me know how you get on or if you need any further help.
Sid
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Suno is currently throwing a hissy fit, not happy being sued.
Failing to distinguish between male and female in prompts, 60% failure rate. Double up in prompts, e.g. MALE, MALE VOCALS, play safe and double up even if you want female! better than wasting your credits.
UPDATE STILL BAD, TRY MALE LOW BASS VOCALS, THIS WORKED ON LAST TWO GENERATIONS.
Sid
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Since the announcement of the lawsuit, Suno is floundering on the rocks of IPO.
It has reverted back to its unreliable "why bother" mode. The latest bug is with extensions, (not the hair type), the "I want to make my song longer type", except it ignores what you want to add and does its own thing, totally random. More wasted credits down the pan.
Keep you posted
Sid
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Yes were worried about billion dollar companies and were on social security . this is war !!! , Right where's my fishing pole and Niel young records .Penalties for Possession of Stolen Property .e.g. Penalties include a maximum fine of $1000 and up to six months in jai. So I'd hide the robots
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Suno's app problems continue to get worse, extensions totally ignore whatever time and section(s) you put in and do their own thing. Strongly advise staying away from any subscriptions until problems are resolved and tested over a significant period of time. If during your initial 4 minute generation it repeats an earlier verse rather than the correct one, this is a strong indication that there will be problems with extensions too!
Sid
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